Style Sheet Times New Roman

On Mon, 11 Feb 2008 16:41:15 -0800, Blinky the Shark
<no.spam RemoveThis @box.invalid> wrote:

>Fred Atkinson wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 11 Feb 2008 17:39:20 -0600, Bergamot <bergamot RemoveThis @visi.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>Characters are used improperly all the time. I use «angle brackets» for
>>>arrows on occasion myself. I think the OP should know that particular
>>>character isn't what he thinks it is and if there is in fact a slashed
>>>zero in Unicode, that's what he should be using instead.
>>
>> Nothing personal, Bergamot,
>>
>> But unless you are a ham radio operator, you couldn't
>> understand the importance of this.
>
>I'm not a ham, but I understand the importance of not confusing zero with
>the letter "O". You seem to be think non-hams are a bit short on
>intelligence. Don't you think it matters to us that if, say, a software
>registration requires a zero we shouldn't try using a letter "O"?

I didn't say you weren't intelligent. I said you'd have to be
a ham radio operator to understand the *importance* of doing it that
way.

When I store zero calls in my database, it is with a real
zero. When I *display* the callsign, I have a subroutine that changes
the zero to 'Ø' so it is displayed that way in the browser. It's
completely in line with good programming *and* ham radio culture.

Jerry has a zero callsign and that's why he's been outspoken
about it. I've got a 4 callsign. But if I had a zero callsign, I'd
probably be even more outspoken about it myself.

Regards,



Fred
 >> Stay informed about: Style Sheet Times New Roman 

Fred Atkinson wrote:

> On Mon, 11 Feb 2008 16:41:15 -0800, Blinky the Shark
> <no.spam DeleteThis @box.invalid> wrote:
>
>>Fred Atkinson wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, 11 Feb 2008 17:39:20 -0600, Bergamot <bergamot DeleteThis @visi.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Characters are used improperly all the time. I use «angle brackets» for
>>>>arrows on occasion myself. I think the OP should know that particular
>>>>character isn't what he thinks it is and if there is in fact a slashed
>>>>zero in Unicode, that's what he should be using instead.
>>>
>>> Nothing personal, Bergamot,
>>>
>>> But unless you are a ham radio operator, you couldn't
>>> understand the importance of this.
>>
>>I'm not a ham, but I understand the importance of not confusing zero with
>>the letter "O". You seem to be think non-hams are a bit short on
>>intelligence. Don't you think it matters to us that if, say, a software
>>registration requires a zero we shouldn't try using a letter "O"?
>
> I didn't say you weren't intelligent. I said you'd have to be
> a ham radio operator to understand the *importance* of doing it that
> way.

Oh. You mean using whatever looks right to convey the idea of "zero", not
that non-hams don't understand the importance of differentiating between
the two. Okay.

> When I store zero calls in my database, it is with a real
> zero. When I *display* the callsign, I have a subroutine that changes
> the zero to 'Ø' so it is displayed that way in the browser. It's
> completely in line with good programming *and* ham radio culture.

I understand. I grew up in 8 land, back when I was a SWL (who never got
around to getting his CW speed up so he could get a ticket) in the upper
Midwest; I've been in 6 since 1981.

And see the image I linked you upthread for how I see your callsign page,
here with my choice of browser fonts.

--
Blinky
Killing all posts from Google Groups
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 >> Stay informed about: Style Sheet Times New Roman 

Bergamot wrote:
> Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>> Bergamot wrote:
>>> Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>>>> The slashed-zero is a digit.
>>> Yes, it is, but the character the OP is using is not a slashed-zero.
>>>
>>> The Ø or Ø or Ø character is a letter, not a number:
>>> LATIN CAPITAL LETTER O WITH STROKE
>>>
>>> http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/00d8/index.htm
>> That's fine. But IN CONTEXT it is the numeral zero.
>>
>> You have to take the context into account, also.
>
> Sorry, but a letter doesn't become a number just because you want it to.
>

You really should understand what you're talking about before you take
your head out of your ass and open your mouth.

--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
jstucklex RemoveThis @attglobal.net
==================
 >> Stay informed about: Style Sheet Times New Roman 

Blinky the Shark wrote:
> Fred Atkinson wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 11 Feb 2008 17:39:20 -0600, Bergamot <bergamot.DeleteThis@visi.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Characters are used improperly all the time. I use «angle brackets» for
>>> arrows on occasion myself. I think the OP should know that particular
>>> character isn't what he thinks it is and if there is in fact a slashed
>>> zero in Unicode, that's what he should be using instead.
>> Nothing personal, Bergamot,
>>
>> But unless you are a ham radio operator, you couldn't
>> understand the importance of this.
>
> I'm not a ham, but I understand the importance of not confusing zero with
> the letter "O". You seem to be think non-hams are a bit short on
> intelligence. Don't you think it matters to us that if, say, a software
> registration requires a zero we shouldn't try using a letter "O"?
>
>

I don't think Fred thinks non-hams are a bit short on intelligence.

But I know I think Bergamot is...

And Blinky, there is a LONG history with hams and the slash-zero. It
long predates ASCII and computers in general.

--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
jstucklex.DeleteThis@attglobal.net
==================
 >> Stay informed about: Style Sheet Times New Roman 

Jerry Stuckle wrote:

> Blinky the Shark wrote:
>> Fred Atkinson wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, 11 Feb 2008 17:39:20 -0600, Bergamot <bergamot DeleteThis @visi.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Characters are used improperly all the time. I use «angle brackets»
>>>> for arrows on occasion myself. I think the OP should know that
>>>> particular character isn't what he thinks it is and if there is in
>>>> fact a slashed zero in Unicode, that's what he should be using
>>>> instead.
>>> Nothing personal, Bergamot,
>>>
>>> But unless you are a ham radio operator, you couldn't
>>> understand the importance of this.
>>
>> I'm not a ham, but I understand the importance of not confusing zero
>> with the letter "O". You seem to be think non-hams are a bit short on
>> intelligence. Don't you think it matters to us that if, say, a
>> software registration requires a zero we shouldn't try using a letter
>> "O"?
>>
>>
> I don't think Fred thinks non-hams are a bit short on intelligence.
>
> But I know I think Bergamot is...
>
> And Blinky, there is a LONG history with hams and the slash-zero. It
> long predates ASCII and computers in general.

I understand slash-zero. I understood it back in the 1960s when I was a
short-wave listener collecting QSLs from all over the world. I've
understood the need to differentiate zero from o for at least that long.
I have no dog in this zero-REPRESENTATION fight. Just thought - now
corrected by Fred's own response to my post - that he was selling the rest
of us short, but now I see that I misunderstood his intent.


--
Blinky
Killing all posts from Google Groups
The Usenet Improvement Project: http://improve-usenet.org
Blinky: http://blinkynet.net
 >> Stay informed about: Style Sheet Times New Roman 

On Mon, 11 Feb 2008 17:30:23 -0800, Blinky the Shark
<no.spam.RemoveThis@box.invalid> wrote:

>Oh. You mean using whatever looks right to convey the idea of "zero", not
>that non-hams don't understand the importance of differentiating between
>the two. Okay.

Now you've got it.

>> When I store zero calls in my database, it is with a real
>> zero. When I *display* the callsign, I have a subroutine that changes
>> the zero to 'Ø' so it is displayed that way in the browser. It's
>> completely in line with good programming *and* ham radio culture.
>
>I understand. I grew up in 8 land, back when I was a SWL (who never got
>around to getting his CW speed up so he could get a ticket) in the upper
>Midwest; I've been in 6 since 1981.

Since they've done away with the code requirement, why aren't
you a ham now? You could probably pass the technician test with a
little repreparation.

>And see the image I linked you upthread for how I see your callsign page,
>here with my choice of browser fonts.

Several people sent images. I'm not sure I remember the
particular one you sent.

Regards,




Fred
 >> Stay informed about: Style Sheet Times New Roman 

Fred Atkinson wrote:

> On Mon, 11 Feb 2008 17:30:23 -0800, Blinky the Shark
> <no.spam RemoveThis @box.invalid> wrote:
>
>>Oh. You mean using whatever looks right to convey the idea of "zero", not
>>that non-hams don't understand the importance of differentiating between
>>the two. Okay.
>
> Now you've got it.
>
>>> When I store zero calls in my database, it is with a real
>>> zero. When I *display* the callsign, I have a subroutine that changes
>>> the zero to 'Ø' so it is displayed that way in the browser. It's
>>> completely in line with good programming *and* ham radio culture.
>>
>>I understand. I grew up in 8 land, back when I was a SWL (who never got
>>around to getting his CW speed up so he could get a ticket) in the upper
>>Midwest; I've been in 6 since 1981.
>
> Since they've done away with the code requirement, why aren't
> you a ham now? You could probably pass the technician test with a
> little repreparation.

Because I have the Internet.

>>And see the image I linked you upthread for how I see your callsign page,
>>here with my choice of browser fonts.
>
> Several people sent images. I'm not sure I remember the
> particular one you sent.

Perfectly fine slashed nearly-round things, in my sans serif font.


--
Blinky
Killing all posts from Google Groups
The Usenet Improvement Project: http://improve-usenet.org
Blinky: http://blinkynet.net
 >> Stay informed about: Style Sheet Times New Roman 

On Mon, 11 Feb 2008 17:33:14 -0800, Blinky the Shark
<no.spam DeleteThis @box.invalid> wrote:

>I understand slash-zero. I understood it back in the 1960s when I was a
>short-wave listener collecting QSLs from all over the world. I've
>understood the need to differentiate zero from o for at least that long.
>I have no dog in this zero-REPRESENTATION fight. Just thought - now
>corrected by Fred's own response to my post - that he was selling the rest
>of us short, but now I see that I misunderstood his intent.

I'm glad we cleared that up. I wasn't trying to offend
anyone.

Regards,



Fred
 >> Stay informed about: Style Sheet Times New Roman 

This message is not archived
 >> Stay informed about: Style Sheet Times New Roman 

Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>
> I understand unicode characters.

Your statements on the subject indicate the opposite.

BTW, calling me names doesn't change the facts.

--
Berg
 >> Stay informed about: Style Sheet Times New Roman 

On Mon, 11 Feb 2008 18:57:29 -0800, Blinky the Shark
<no.spam RemoveThis @box.invalid> wrote:

>> Since they've done away with the code requirement, why aren't
>> you a ham now? You could probably pass the technician test with a
>> little repreparation.
>
>Because I have the Internet.

That's all the more reason to get your technician license.
Have you heard of Echolink (http://www.echolink.org) and APRS
(http://www.aprs.org)? Both are integrated into the Internet for
operation. And there are other things. All you need for operation in
these modes is a technician class license.

>>>And see the image I linked you upthread for how I see your callsign page,
>>>here with my choice of browser fonts.
>>
>> Several people sent images. I'm not sure I remember the
>> particular one you sent.
>
>Perfectly fine slashed nearly-round things, in my sans serif font.

Sounds right.

Regards,



Fred
 >> Stay informed about: Style Sheet Times New Roman 

Fred Atkinson wrote:

> On Mon, 11 Feb 2008 18:57:29 -0800, Blinky the Shark
> <no.spam DeleteThis @box.invalid> wrote:
>
>>> Since they've done away with the code requirement, why aren't
>>> you a ham now? You could probably pass the technician test with a
>>> little repreparation.
>>
>>Because I have the Internet.
>
> That's all the more reason to get your technician license.
> Have you heard of Echolink (http://www.echolink.org) and APRS
> (http://www.aprs.org)? Both are integrated into the Internet for
> operation. And there are other things. All you need for operation in
> these modes is a technician class license.

Engh. Thanks for the suggestion, though, Fred.

>>>>And see the image I linked you upthread for how I see your callsign page,
>>>>here with my choice of browser fonts.
>>>
>>> Several people sent images. I'm not sure I remember the
>>> particular one you sent.
>>
>>Perfectly fine slashed nearly-round things, in my sans serif font.
>
> Sounds right.

I thought you were trying to force TNR on me.


--
Blinky
Killing all posts from Google Groups
The Usenet Improvement Project: http://improve-usenet.org
Blinky: http://blinkynet.net
 >> Stay informed about: Style Sheet Times New Roman 

On Mon, 11 Feb 2008 21:25:57 -0800, Blinky the Shark
<no.spam RemoveThis @box.invalid> wrote:

>> That's all the more reason to get your technician license.
>> Have you heard of Echolink (http://www.echolink.org) and APRS
>> (http://www.aprs.org)? Both are integrated into the Internet for
>> operation. And there are other things. All you need for operation in
>> these modes is a technician class license.
>
>Engh. Thanks for the suggestion, though, Fred.

You're welcome. And feel free to talk with either Jerry or
myself if you decide to pursue your license. We can answer questions
about how to go about it and where to get the materials needed to
prepare for the test.

>>>>>And see the image I linked you upthread for how I see your callsign page,
>>>>>here with my choice of browser fonts.
>>>>
>>>> Several people sent images. I'm not sure I remember the
>>>> particular one you sent.
>>>
>>>Perfectly fine slashed nearly-round things, in my sans serif font.
>>
>> Sounds right.
>
>I thought you were trying to force TNR on me.

Why would I do that? I chose TNR for this application because
it supports a font that I require for a special purpose.

Regards,



Fred
 >> Stay informed about: Style Sheet Times New Roman