HTML email newsletters -- need advice

Jim Royal wrote:
: > A couple of clients have asked me to manage their email newsletters for
: > them. I'm trying to suss out the potential pitfalls, and any
: > suggestions are welcome.

"Doc O'Leary" responded:
: Don't. Just don't.


: > Any recommendations as to how to proceed?
:
: Tell them to put a news section on their site and be done with it.
: Bonus points if they offer an RSS feed for it.


Why are you so against email newsletters? They're a valuable marketing tool
and aren't hurting anyone as long as the mailings are opt-in only, which
they are in this situation. Newsletters that arrive in people's in-boxes
make the content more personal and keep the company name and
products/services in the customers' minds.

Suggestions to Jim:

- Contact your ISP and your web host now to ask them about their policies
about sending newsletters to opt-in subscribers. Most likely it's fine with
them, and your checking with them first shows that you aren't trying to get
away with anything.

- Have links to the privacy and opt-in policies in each newsletter issue and
at the company websites.

With the above, it would be hard for anyone to accuse you of spamming.

Lois
 >> Stay informed about: HTML email newsletters -- need advice 

In article <droleary.usenet-A58EE0.13301101022004.DeleteThis@corp.supernews.com>,
Doc O'Leary <droleary.usenet.DeleteThis@subsume.com> wrote:

 > Tell them to put a news section on their site and be done with it.
 > Bonus points if they offer an RSS feed for it.

Defeats the purpose. Newsletters are required.

--
Jim Royal
"Understanding is a three-edged sword"
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://JimRoyal.com" target="_blank">http://JimRoyal.com</a><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: HTML email newsletters -- need advice 

In article <_QcTb.683$f7.142@fe02.usenetserver.com>, Lois
<thiswillbounce.TakeThisOut@excite.com> wrote:

 > - Contact your ISP and your web host now to ask them about their policies
 > about sending newsletters to opt-in subscribers. Most likely it's fine with
 > them, and your checking with them first shows that you aren't trying to get
 > away with anything.
 >
 > - Have links to the privacy and opt-in policies in each newsletter issue and
 > at the company websites.

Thanks very much, Lois. Will do.

--
Jim Royal
"Understanding is a three-edged sword"
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://JimRoyal.com" target="_blank">http://JimRoyal.com</a><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: HTML email newsletters -- need advice 

In article <_QcTb.683$f7.142@fe02.usenetserver.com>,
"Lois" <thiswillbounce DeleteThis @excite.com> wrote:

 > Why are you so against email newsletters?

Spam.

 > They're a valuable marketing tool

Valuable to the company != valuable to the customer

 > and aren't hurting anyone as long as the mailings are opt-in only

The effort to maintain clean subscriptions is not worth the efforts.

 > Newsletters that arrive in people's in-boxes
 > make the content more personal and keep the company name and
 > products/services in the customers' minds.

That's your justification? You offered them a service that wasn't
memorable, so you'd keep bugging them about it? Please! An RSS feed
with *useful* information will do a lot more for good will than yet
another commercial in my inbox, opt-in or not.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: HTML email newsletters -- need advice 

Lois:
: > Why are you so against email newsletters?

"Doc O'Leary":
: Spam.
:
: > They're a valuable marketing tool
:
: Valuable to the company != valuable to the customer

I agree. They're valuable to both. But they certainly aren't spam when the
recipients choose to receive them.

In addition to having the newsletters emailed to subscribers, they provide
content for the company website to attract more people to the site. People
who just want to read the info at the site don't have to subscribe. But a
lot of people do subscribe, which indicates that having the content
delivered is useful to them.


: > and aren't hurting anyone as long as the mailings are opt-in only
:
: The effort to maintain clean subscriptions is not worth the efforts.

In your opinion. Perhaps you haven't looked seriously at the benefits of
email newsletters.


: > Newsletters that arrive in people's in-boxes
: > make the content more personal and keep the company name and
: > products/services in the customers' minds.
:
: That's your justification? You offered them a service that wasn't
: memorable, so you'd keep bugging them about it? Please!

I never said that the service wasn't memorable. I just said that newsletters
help customers remember the service. Or perhaps they didn't even do business
with the company, but came across a newsletter article at the company
website, found it interesting, and decided to subscribe to receive more.

If you do business with 2 online companies and you consider them to be more
or less equal in products and service, and you read a monthly newsletter
from one of them, which company are you more likely to do business with in
the future?

Another benefit to both customers and companies is that newsletters can
contain links to info about the company's products and services. This makes
it easier for the customer to do business with that company.


An RSS feed
: with *useful* information will do a lot more for good will than yet
: another commercial in my inbox, opt-in or not.

It sounds like you don't read newsletters. They're a way to have information
that's relevant to you sent right to your in-box, saving you from having to
go and look for it. In my experience, they often contain info that I
wouldn't have looked for specifically but which is interesting and useful to
me.

More info about the usefulness of email newsletters is at
www.useit.com/alertbox/20020930.html.

Lois
 >> Stay informed about: HTML email newsletters -- need advice 

Doc O'Leary schrieb:
 >
 > In article <_QcTb.683$f7.142@fe02.usenetserver.com>,
 > "Lois" <thiswillbounce DeleteThis @excite.com> wrote:
  > > Newsletters that arrive in people's in-boxes
  > > make the content more personal and keep the company name and
  > > products/services in the customers' minds.
 >
 > That's your justification? You offered them a service that wasn't
 > memorable, so you'd keep bugging them about it? Please! An RSS feed
 > with *useful* information will do a lot more for good will than yet
 > another commercial in my inbox, opt-in or not.

It looks like people are jumping on the RSS bandwagon with the same vain
hope they previously placed on bulk mailing, newsletters, HTML mails,
downloadable screensavers etc.

Just because RSS is still somewhat new and trendy at the same time
doesn't mean it's any better than traditional newsletters. Many RSS
feeds are indeed already as useless as bulk mail and newsletters.

The reason is quite simple: Most companies really don't have enough news
to justify a feed. So they syndicate content from other feeds into their
own feed. This is not a bad thing in and of itself; if I'm interested in
dairy products and subscribe to my favourite dairy company's RSS feed, I
don't mind if they give me some related info from 'other sources'. But
once I subscribe to more than one dairy company feed, I end up getting
the same 'other sources' info twice, or three times, four times... you
get the idea.

Useful information is the key, whether you deliver it in the latest
buzzword compliant format or a carrier pigeon.


Matthias<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: HTML email newsletters -- need advice 

Doc O'Leary wrote such rubbish:
 > In article <_QcTb.683$f7.142@fe02.usenetserver.com>,
 > "Lois" <thiswillbounce.DeleteThis@excite.com> wrote:
 >
  >> Why are you so against email newsletters?
 >
 > Spam.
 >
  >> They're a valuable marketing tool
 >
 > Valuable to the company != valuable to the customer
 >
  >> and aren't hurting anyone as long as the mailings are opt-in only
 >
 > The effort to maintain clean subscriptions is not worth the efforts.
 >
  >> Newsletters that arrive in people's in-boxes
  >> make the content more personal and keep the company name and
  >> products/services in the customers' minds.
 >
 > That's your justification? You offered them a service that wasn't
 > memorable, so you'd keep bugging them about it? Please! An RSS feed
 > with *useful* information will do a lot more for good will than yet
 > another commercial in my inbox, opt-in or not.

But I like receiving (with opt-in) some emails from some sites that offer
some very useful information in a nice HTML formatted email newsletter.

Are you suggesting that because there are some who abuse this newsletter
approach for marketing then the whole newsletter concept should be
abollished? - That is like saying that we should abollish my snail-mail
subscription to my fishing magazines because there are some companies that
send me junk mail.

I find absolutley nothing useful in what you are saying doc o'leary.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: HTML email newsletters -- need advice 

"Jim Royal" <jimroyal DeleteThis @canada.com> wrote in message
news:020220041242125877%jimroyal@canada.com...
 > In article <droleary.usenet-A58EE0.13301101022004 DeleteThis @corp.supernews.com>,
 > Doc O'Leary <droleary.usenet DeleteThis @subsume.com> wrote:
 >
  > > Tell them to put a news section on their site and be done with it.
  > > Bonus points if they offer an RSS feed for it.
 >
 > Defeats the purpose. Newsletters are required.
 >
Hey Jim,
Dont take any notice of the knockers!
As long as the newsletters are opt in they *are* a valuable tool - and work.
I have a lot of clients that use them.
One small point, when they sign up (opt in) it is useful to record their
receiving preferences.
Little things like how often, ie, weekly, monthly etc. and receiving format
as in txt or html

a second - perhaps more important point. Ensure there is a top notch
recording system (db) so the system does not get out of control. I.e. email
going to people who have opted out, misaddressing and wrong persons name in
the greeting. (you did mention personalised?)

As for your host or ISP, check if they have a limit on e-mail sends. We
restrict e-mail sent from one domain to <secret amount> per hour. When a
(proven trusted) client has a bonafide list to send out we open the option
on request to <more than the secret amount> per hour

Some providers may also require you to spread your mailing out so if you had
1000 subscribers, say, you may only be able to send 200 per hour thus
spreading the mail out over a 5 hour period.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: HTML email newsletters -- need advice 

In article <401eb990 RemoveThis @clear.net.nz>, Bill Logan <who RemoveThis @what.com> wrote:

 > Dont take any notice of the knockers!

Oh, I'm well aware of the religious radicals that populate usenet. <g>

 > As long as the newsletters are opt in they *are* a valuable tool - and work.

Agreed.

 > One small point, when they sign up (opt in) it is useful to record their
 > receiving preferences.
 > Little things like how often, ie, weekly, monthly etc. and receiving format
 > as in txt or html

I hadn't considered asking about frequency. I may suggest that. Thanks.

 > a second - perhaps more important point. Ensure there is a top notch
 > recording system (db) so the system does not get out of control. I.e. email
 > going to people who have opted out, misaddressing and wrong persons name in
 > the greeting. (you did mention personalised?)

Very good point. Have you any suggestions on this count? The word of
experience carries much weight.

--
Jim Royal
"Understanding is a three-edged sword"
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://JimRoyal.com" target="_blank">http://JimRoyal.com</a><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: HTML email newsletters -- need advice 

In article <401EB194.D3B32CC9.RemoveThis@gmx.net>,
Matthias Gutfeldt <say-no-to-spam.RemoveThis@gmx.net> wrote:

 > It looks like people are jumping on the RSS bandwagon with the same vain
 > hope they previously placed on bulk mailing, newsletters, HTML mails,
 > downloadable screensavers etc.

What hope would that be? I use RSS to offer news to people who are
interested. What are the bandwagon people trying to do with it?

 > Just because RSS is still somewhat new and trendy at the same time
 > doesn't mean it's any better than traditional newsletters. Many RSS
 > feeds are indeed already as useless as bulk mail and newsletters.

The difference being I don't have to unsubscribe to something I many
never have subscribed to. A feed is something that doesn't just pop up
in my mailbox along with a hundred other "forced" messages of spam that
I never asked for.

 > The reason is quite simple: Most companies really don't have enough news
 > to justify a feed. So they syndicate content from other feeds into their
 > own feed.

Then stop reading their feed. What's the problem?

 > Useful information is the key, whether you deliver it in the latest
 > buzzword compliant format or a carrier pigeon.

Right, and email is fast becoming crowded out with useless information.
People control what RSS feeds they get, and from that respect news is
better delivered via pull than push.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: HTML email newsletters -- need advice 

In article <KJETb.410$KW.26388@news.optus.net.au>,
"Disco Octopus" <discooctopusN05PAM RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote:

  >> But I like receiving (with opt-in) some emails from some sites that
offer
 > some very useful information in a nice HTML formatted email newsletter.

It's not about what you like to get, it's about all the other commercial
messages you *don't* like to get via email. A newsletter is easy to
lose in with dozens of spam, and it's possible you'll get mistaken and
reported as spam. If you're willing to risk that, fine. If not,
consider how alternatives better serve your intent.

 > Are you suggesting that because there are some who abuse this newsletter
 > approach for marketing then the whole newsletter concept should be
 > abollished? - That is like saying that we should abollish my snail-mail
 > subscription to my fishing magazines because there are some companies that
 > send me junk mail.

Look, if I was getting 100 pieces of junk mail for every good letter
then, yes, I would not suggest using the USPS. Look at your own email;
you had to insert N05PAM because email has turned into a crapfest! No
smart business would want to take any part in that.

 > I find absolutley nothing useful in what you are saying doc o'leary.

Is that my fault?<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: HTML email newsletters -- need advice 

In article <QaDTb.783$cx3.11@fe01.usenetserver.com>,
"Lois" <auto-newsgroups RemoveThis @wordsweave.com> wrote:

 > I agree. They're valuable to both. But they certainly aren't spam when the
 > recipients choose to receive them.

I didn't say they were spam, I said they shouldn't be used because of
spam.

 > In your opinion. Perhaps you haven't looked seriously at the benefits of
 > email newsletters.

My inbox benefits from fewer messages trying to sell me things. If I'm
interested what you have, I can go to your web site. If you want to
frequently change what is on your site, you can inform me with an RSS
notification.

 > If you do business with 2 online companies and you consider them to be more
 > or less equal in products and service, and you read a monthly newsletter
 > from one of them, which company are you more likely to do business with in
 > the future?

The one that wasn't knocked off their provider because their newsletter
was mixed in with, and accidently reported as, spam.

 > Another benefit to both customers and companies is that newsletters can
 > contain links to info about the company's products and services. This makes
 > it easier for the customer to do business with that company.

Yeah, if only RSS had a link element. Wait, it does!

 > It sounds like you don't read newsletters.

Sounds like you don't know anything about RSS.

 > More info about the usefulness of email newsletters is at
<font color=purple> > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.useit.com/alertbox/20020930.html.</font" target="_blank">www.useit.com/alertbox/20020930.html.</font</a>>

Yes, definitely read that article closely and then think about how much
the email landscape has changed since it was written. Especially the
follow-up:

<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.useit.com/alertbox/20040105.html" target="_blank">http://www.useit.com/alertbox/20040105.html</a>

which states:

"Email messages that customers actually want, such as useful newsletters
or customer-service confirmations, don't survive overflowing inboxes --
often because senders ignore the principles of good email design."<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: HTML email newsletters -- need advice 

"Jim Royal" <jimroyal.DeleteThis@canada.com> wrote in message
news:020220042329435345%jimroyal@canada.com...
 > In article <401eb990.DeleteThis@clear.net.nz>, Bill Logan <who.DeleteThis@what.com> wrote:
 >
  > > Dont take any notice of the knockers!
 >
 > Oh, I'm well aware of the religious radicals that populate usenet. <g>
 >
  > > As long as the newsletters are opt in they *are* a valuable tool - and
work.
 >
 > Agreed.
 >
  > > One small point, when they sign up (opt in) it is useful to record their
  > > receiving preferences.
  > > Little things like how often, ie, weekly, monthly etc. and receiving
format
  > > as in txt or html
 >
 > I hadn't considered asking about frequency. I may suggest that. Thanks.
 >
  > > a second - perhaps more important point. Ensure there is a top notch
  > > recording system (db) so the system does not get out of control. I.e.
email
  > > going to people who have opted out, misaddressing and wrong persons name
in
  > > the greeting. (you did mention personalised?)
 >
 > Very good point. Have you any suggestions on this count? The word of
 > experience carries much weight.
 >
Depends how you do it. If you keep your lists and send the email from your
local machine, (I am assuming windows:-( then probably access with html
mailer (allos for plain text as well as mail merge from the databse to
personalise etc.)
On *nix I would go for a mix of php and MySql. Either way, set up your
databse so that opt outs tables are compared with opt ins to negate opt ins
who had opted out.

Sorry for sounding a bit monty python but I couldnt think of another way to
put it.
If you are not sure of the scripting thewre are some useful examples at
phpscripts etc.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: HTML email newsletters -- need advice